Sorry, don't mean to be on your back again but I think you missed some of the nuances of the lyrics which make it such a great song. You are totally correct about the first part being about Jewish children orphaned by the Holocaust. I think this part really evokes sympathy for the Jewish people and gives hope about the establishment of a place where they can sing and call home. The Jewish people will "turn blood into wine"; they will overcome the violence done to them and celebrate the future.
Sorry, don't mean to be on your back again but I think you missed some of the nuances of the lyrics which make it such a great song. You are totally correct about the first part being about Jewish children orphaned by the Holocaust. I think this part really evokes sympathy for the Jewish people and gives hope about the establishment of a place where they can sing and call home. The Jewish people will "turn blood into wine"; they will overcome the violence done to them and celebrate the future.
However, I interpreted the following lines differently....
However, I interpreted the following lines differently. To me the sense of hope and healing quickly changes in the lines: "The sweet taste in your mouth--turned bitter in its glass". If the song was about Israel surviving and being successful it would have been the other way around, from bitter to sweet, but its not.
The reason for this, I think, comes through in later lines and has to do with the situation of the Palestinians:
Red and green reflects the scene
Of a long forgotten dream
There were princes and there were kings
Now hidden in disguise--cheap wrappings of lies
Red and green are Palestinian colors. I think this stanza is a reference to the way that the past has been manipulated in Israel to neglect the histories of the Palestinians for political gain.
The toothless man at the end is one of the children from the start, but his song has become full of "jealousy". The hope from the start has degenerated completely: "Their hate is clanging--maddening". The Palestinians are now as hated and homeless as the Jews once were.
She ends up asking "In Israel will they sing Happy Noel", which suggests that peace and happiness is possible in the future, but it is only a distant prospect, just a song that hasn't been sung yet.
Uh...knowing Siouxsie, happy noel does not refer to happiness and peace in the future.
Uh...knowing Siouxsie, happy noel does not refer to happiness and peace in the future.
"In Isreal will they sing happy noel" most likely refers to christianity/book of revelation..in the book of revelation, jesus returns to earth...and specifically jerusalem...and the jews must either "come to jesus" or go to hell (I resist saying "convert" because revelation was allegedly written prior to christianity coming into existience). of course, this is being stated in a sardonic sense, mocking all parties involved in religious nonsense (christian, muslim, jew). but that particular phrase probably refers to this revelation of st john scenario....
"In Isreal will they sing happy noel" most likely refers to christianity/book of revelation..in the book of revelation, jesus returns to earth...and specifically jerusalem...and the jews must either "come to jesus" or go to hell (I resist saying "convert" because revelation was allegedly written prior to christianity coming into existience). of course, this is being stated in a sardonic sense, mocking all parties involved in religious nonsense (christian, muslim, jew). but that particular phrase probably refers to this revelation of st john scenario.
I agree with you Adr10723 about the orphaned children - but on a larger scale it is ALL of the surviving European Jews who realized they had no home in Europe after WWII and therefore returned to Israel in 1948.
I don't agree with all of Perko's pro-Palestinian sentiments, but his comments have made me see aspects of the lyrics in a radically new way.
The lines you cite [The sweet taste...turned bitter in its glass]always remind me of these lines in Revelation Ch.10:
7 But in the days of the voice of the seventh angel, when he shall begin to sound, the...
I agree with you Adr10723 about the orphaned children - but on a larger scale it is ALL of the surviving European Jews who realized they had no home in Europe after WWII and therefore returned to Israel in 1948.
I don't agree with all of Perko's pro-Palestinian sentiments, but his comments have made me see aspects of the lyrics in a radically new way.
The lines you cite [The sweet taste...turned bitter in its glass]always remind me of these lines in Revelation Ch.10:
7 But in the days of the voice of the seventh angel, when he shall begin to sound, the mystery of God should be finished, as he hath declared to his servants the prophets.
8 And the voice which I heard from heaven spake unto me again, and said, Go and take the little book which is open in the hand of the angel which standeth upon the sea and upon the earth.
9 And I went unto the angel, and said unto him, Give me the little book. And he said unto me, Take it, and eat it up; and it shall make thy belly bitter, but it shall be in thy mouth sweet as honey.
10 And I took the little book out of the angel's hand, and ate it up; and it was in my mouth sweet as honey: and as soon as I had eaten it, my belly was bitter.
11 And he said unto me, Thou must prophesy again before many peoples, and nations, and tongues, and kings.
Hey Antioch - how can you say that Revelation was written BEFORE Christianity?
As follows:
Little orphans in the snow With nowhere to call a home Start their singing
This is the orphaned children after the Holocaust who went to Israel.
Waiting through the summertime To thaw your hearts in wintertime That's why they're singing...
This is European holiday makers visiting Israel during winter months.
Waiting for a sign to turn blood into wine The sweet taste in your mouth--turned bitter in its glass Israel...in Israel
As Israel has become successful and has survives the wars waged against her, jealousy and resentment emerge.
Sorry, don't mean to be on your back again but I think you missed some of the nuances of the lyrics which make it such a great song. You are totally correct about the first part being about Jewish children orphaned by the Holocaust. I think this part really evokes sympathy for the Jewish people and gives hope about the establishment of a place where they can sing and call home. The Jewish people will "turn blood into wine"; they will overcome the violence done to them and celebrate the future.
Sorry, don't mean to be on your back again but I think you missed some of the nuances of the lyrics which make it such a great song. You are totally correct about the first part being about Jewish children orphaned by the Holocaust. I think this part really evokes sympathy for the Jewish people and gives hope about the establishment of a place where they can sing and call home. The Jewish people will "turn blood into wine"; they will overcome the violence done to them and celebrate the future.
However, I interpreted the following lines differently....
However, I interpreted the following lines differently. To me the sense of hope and healing quickly changes in the lines: "The sweet taste in your mouth--turned bitter in its glass". If the song was about Israel surviving and being successful it would have been the other way around, from bitter to sweet, but its not.
The reason for this, I think, comes through in later lines and has to do with the situation of the Palestinians:
Red and green reflects the scene Of a long forgotten dream There were princes and there were kings Now hidden in disguise--cheap wrappings of lies
Red and green are Palestinian colors. I think this stanza is a reference to the way that the past has been manipulated in Israel to neglect the histories of the Palestinians for political gain.
The toothless man at the end is one of the children from the start, but his song has become full of "jealousy". The hope from the start has degenerated completely: "Their hate is clanging--maddening". The Palestinians are now as hated and homeless as the Jews once were.
She ends up asking "In Israel will they sing Happy Noel", which suggests that peace and happiness is possible in the future, but it is only a distant prospect, just a song that hasn't been sung yet.
Uh...knowing Siouxsie, happy noel does not refer to happiness and peace in the future.
Uh...knowing Siouxsie, happy noel does not refer to happiness and peace in the future.
"In Isreal will they sing happy noel" most likely refers to christianity/book of revelation..in the book of revelation, jesus returns to earth...and specifically jerusalem...and the jews must either "come to jesus" or go to hell (I resist saying "convert" because revelation was allegedly written prior to christianity coming into existience). of course, this is being stated in a sardonic sense, mocking all parties involved in religious nonsense (christian, muslim, jew). but that particular phrase probably refers to this revelation of st john scenario....
"In Isreal will they sing happy noel" most likely refers to christianity/book of revelation..in the book of revelation, jesus returns to earth...and specifically jerusalem...and the jews must either "come to jesus" or go to hell (I resist saying "convert" because revelation was allegedly written prior to christianity coming into existience). of course, this is being stated in a sardonic sense, mocking all parties involved in religious nonsense (christian, muslim, jew). but that particular phrase probably refers to this revelation of st john scenario.
I agree with you Adr10723 about the orphaned children - but on a larger scale it is ALL of the surviving European Jews who realized they had no home in Europe after WWII and therefore returned to Israel in 1948. I don't agree with all of Perko's pro-Palestinian sentiments, but his comments have made me see aspects of the lyrics in a radically new way. The lines you cite [The sweet taste...turned bitter in its glass]always remind me of these lines in Revelation Ch.10: 7 But in the days of the voice of the seventh angel, when he shall begin to sound, the...
I agree with you Adr10723 about the orphaned children - but on a larger scale it is ALL of the surviving European Jews who realized they had no home in Europe after WWII and therefore returned to Israel in 1948. I don't agree with all of Perko's pro-Palestinian sentiments, but his comments have made me see aspects of the lyrics in a radically new way. The lines you cite [The sweet taste...turned bitter in its glass]always remind me of these lines in Revelation Ch.10: 7 But in the days of the voice of the seventh angel, when he shall begin to sound, the mystery of God should be finished, as he hath declared to his servants the prophets.
8 And the voice which I heard from heaven spake unto me again, and said, Go and take the little book which is open in the hand of the angel which standeth upon the sea and upon the earth.
9 And I went unto the angel, and said unto him, Give me the little book. And he said unto me, Take it, and eat it up; and it shall make thy belly bitter, but it shall be in thy mouth sweet as honey.
10 And I took the little book out of the angel's hand, and ate it up; and it was in my mouth sweet as honey: and as soon as I had eaten it, my belly was bitter.
11 And he said unto me, Thou must prophesy again before many peoples, and nations, and tongues, and kings.
Hey Antioch - how can you say that Revelation was written BEFORE Christianity?