Tuwy...no offense but even tho you're not a christian preacher as you say, with your post you're still trying to hammer this song into our heads as being religiously rooted(as if to reinforce Jesse's supposed belief in god) and i'm just not buying it.
Here's Why:
This song is simply about Jesse having lost his faith in God. Now that he thinks he knows (and being pretty much an atheist I would have to agree with him 100%) that there is no heaven and God he feels lost. I recall myself that I slept a lot easier when I was a child because hey...you're going to heaven when you die and everything is going to be alright. Well, studying philosophy, going to college, thinking for myself, doing my own research and recognizing that Christianity was actually invented by a king hundreds of years ago is enough for me to form my own conclusion about life after death...no one really "knows" what is going to happen. They may believe they do and feel very strongly and this may ease or totally rid them of their own "millstones" they may experience without their beliefs, but anyone who reads this should realize that their ease is only due to a "belief"...not a fact. Anyone who is heavily religious...really think about that and let it sink in for a moment. If you disagree with my standpoint please feel free to post back in reference to me...but at least put up a valid arguement and not a rash, angry rant as this will only make you look silly.
The burden of knowing that he isn't going to heaven(or merely the fact that he just doesn't believe he will anymore now that he's renounced his religious beliefs) is FREAKING HIM OUT (he can't sleep anymore and so forth. This burden is the metaphorical "millstone" around his neck.
When he says "Take me out Tonight" he is begging for someone or something to give him new faith to replace that which he has lost(again he has pretty much totally lost faith in God) in order ease his mind and conscience so he can "sleep without a single stir" as he did when he was a child...When everything was simpler because he just didn't really think or question things as much. When you're young, everything is pretty much cut and dry. You're going to heaven...everything is gonna be ok. Again beliefs can make you feel powerful emotions...but in the end they are just beliefs and not the ultimate truth. You only find that out after you die...if you are even capable of processing a logical thought at that point. (Ok, i'm getting too heady for myself so that's enough with the religious analysis).
And again, when he asks for someone to be his "breath" he is looking for something( be it a person or a new way of life) to put the wind back in his sails. His loss of religious faith has really devestated him as I'm assuming he was very faithful to Christianity or whatever it was throughout his childhood and teen years. He could be asking for a person to share some new views with him...perhaps a new religion or just another way of life that helps people get by and be a little less insane knowing that one day they are going to die. Live just may not end the way the Catholic Church or other religions/institutions want you to believe. Stop letting religious dogmas rule your life and thoughts. As Timothy Leary said: "Think for yourself, question authority."
I almost kinda miss the days when I used to go to church and believe in "their" God. It was really easy. I mean, for me to admit I don't believe in Christianity or any religion is really tough. Imagine believing so very strongly in something that BILLIONS of other people take part in worldwide, every day. Then imagine through your own conquest of thought and questioning that the reasoning you accepted wasn't yours at all, real, right or the truth. Imagine stepping outside of that box and feeling like you just got hit by a Mack Truck, you're on the same road and you know the way home but nothing feels right. On the walk home it just isn't the same and never will be again, ever because of this realization you have come to. You don't have to agree with me, but i believe this is what Jesse Lacey is trying to express with these lyrics.
One thing i enjoyed was the metaphor terrorhawk suggested about the millstone being alcohol and the ship of fools being the bar scene. One thing my explanation didn't resolve was the ship of fools reference....but that metaphor works out quite nicely. Another way of looking at the song that makes sense. But thinking real quickly now I will tie that into my interpretation as well.
When he says "The ship of fools I'm on will sink" I think he is merely referring to his current sinful and destructive path( he's not trying to impress his parents anymore, he's lost touch with his friends, doesn't pray anymore), and he doesn't really care. Yet in the back of his head there is still a part of him that would accept somebody removing him from this path, relieving the burden of his millstone and being his breath now that he is "drowning" for being a sinner in his new ways, but again : Now that he has lost his faith in God he doesn't go about things the way he used to and he can't (because he just doesn't believe anymore, it's just simply no longer in him).
Also at the end of the song, two people are discussing if who they see is who they really think it is. They recognize the person but something is different that makes them question his identity :"I think I recognize him. Sure it's him?" This is Jesse explaining in a clever way how different he feels now that he has lost his faith. He feels so different that he doesn't think anyone will even recognize him anymore.
I could really write about this all night but a few things that left me hanging in this song and they were
1."Never hit the brakes there's no time to save him,
he's run out in the street"
Perhaps this is referring to his loss of faith being as unexpected and tragic as being hit by a car...hmmm that ties really well into my "getting hit by a truck thing I mentioned before, so I am going to use this explanation.*sorry everyone I am writing this thing on the fly trying to do the best I can.
When he says "running from that mistake" he is either referring to his faith all those years as a waste of time or well, a mistake. Or perhaps he is referring to the fact that since other people have discovered he lost interest in religion, they view his new frame of mind as a mistake, but he doesn't believe it as so...hmm yeah I think i'm gonna have to go with that one . So in other words Jesse was using the people talking about him as a way of describing his own thoughts on what happened. His loss of faith happened so suddenly, it was like being hit by a car and it's sad that it happened but that's just the way things worked out. The way that things have panned out in his mind, he can't change the way he feels.
I really feel like I could have organized this better but I think I got my interpretation of this across decently enough. If you agree/disagree...please let me hear it. Goodnight
Hey man I know i am reading your post 2 and half years after you posted it and I pray that you have found the Truth but if not, all the more power to you. I am not replying to "rant" (as you would put it) but rather consider another view. First off all, i was wondering what "king" you think made up Christianity... and where you heard that. Secondly, I gathered from your post that you believe that Christianity is simply a "crutch" for the emotionally weak. So it is basically something we can lean...
Hey man I know i am reading your post 2 and half years after you posted it and I pray that you have found the Truth but if not, all the more power to you. I am not replying to "rant" (as you would put it) but rather consider another view. First off all, i was wondering what "king" you think made up Christianity... and where you heard that. Secondly, I gathered from your post that you believe that Christianity is simply a "crutch" for the emotionally weak. So it is basically something we can lean on when life gets too difficult? But I am here to ask... have you looked at it from your standpoint- assuming your still an atheist. Somewhere along the line, you came to the conclusion that you didn't believe in God. And just as we Believers lean on God, you have to lean on the fact that there is no God. My point here is just that if Christianity can be rejected as irrational simply because some people find it comforting, then the same must be true of atheism. And if atheism cannot be dismissed in this way, as the atheist will surely hold, then neither can Christianity. Atheism offers an easy way out for those unable to deal with the reality of life with God. Thirdly, if all that believers were after were a comforting belief system then they could do much better than Christianity. The Christian gospel, good news though it is, is not unequivocally comforting. The idea that if you believe in God then life’s a breeze over-simplifies the Christian experience. Christianity does not teach that Christians get an easy ride; in fact, it stresses that believers may well undergo great suffering in this life. It also makes people aware of their fallenness, of their sinfulness, and that can hurt. For all the comfort that Christianity offers in terms of eternal security, even its teachings about eternity have a downside; many Christians face the painful experience of expecting close friends and relatives to face just punishment for their sins. If believers were really just after comforting beliefs, then they could do a lot better than Christianity. For example, they could believe that suffering is just an illusion, that there are no moral constraints that oblige us not to do what we want to do, and that all (not just Christians) are destined to enjoy a blissful afterlife in heaven..... I do not expect this to instantly and dramatically change your life, but I hope you DO think about it, because if you just brush it off, you are contradicting your opinion of "belief" and leaning on your own personally emotional crutch. Please just give it a chance. If Jesus was just something I use to put my mind to rest about life after death, I would NOT be replying to your post in the first place. Know that someone out there is praying for you. God Bless
You don't need God to be content. God is a crutch. You can claim atheism is a crutch, but the LACK of something is not a crutch. It just means we DON'T think about the idea at all. We don't 'believe in atheism' because atheism is the denial of the existence of gods in general.
You don't need God to be content. God is a crutch. You can claim atheism is a crutch, but the LACK of something is not a crutch. It just means we DON'T think about the idea at all. We don't 'believe in atheism' because atheism is the denial of the existence of gods in general.
We just don't think about it at all. Its like asking some normal person if they're an 'anti-dog strangler'. You never categorized it into that kind of dichotomy before and so you just don't normally think about it.
We just don't think about it at all. Its like asking some normal person if they're an 'anti-dog strangler'. You never categorized it into that kind of dichotomy before and so you just don't normally think about it.
I'm honestly sorry for you that you...
I'm honestly sorry for you that you have taken the easy way out and feel as if you have discovered the answers. But, life is a journey and it is mighty ignorant of you to feel that you have it all worked out. Be a man like some of us who choose to face the journey and try and learn instead of being so smug as to thinking we have it all figured out.
Your god does not have the answer to everything and it would be ignorant to imply it. Your book even has a shitty description of him full of holes open to wide interpretation in that you and someone else who call themselves christians have no similar ideas whatsoever. Its a charade and a waste of time.
Even this is a bit off topic, I would like to say I was an atheist until I became more educated. This is because I used to think that I knew there was no God, now I know that this thought is irrational. Logically thinking, God is could be real, just as God could not be real. Just because something cannot be proven true does not mean it is false; just as something that cannot be proven false is true. In other words, just because one cannot prove God exists, does not mean he is not real, and vise versa....
Even this is a bit off topic, I would like to say I was an atheist until I became more educated. This is because I used to think that I knew there was no God, now I know that this thought is irrational. Logically thinking, God is could be real, just as God could not be real. Just because something cannot be proven true does not mean it is false; just as something that cannot be proven false is true. In other words, just because one cannot prove God exists, does not mean he is not real, and vise versa. Therefore, I became an agnostic. I hope this helps others come to the same conclusion as I.
personnally, i agree with tg617... especially about coming to terms with sins and all of the flaws that we, as humans, have. Considering the album is called "The devil and God are raging inside of me" it probably means his mind in in turmoil of making the effort to be what he was raised as(a christian) and what he has become. Atemporal says it perfectly "he's a sinner whose eventually going to drown in the depths of the sea if he continues on his current path". the name of the album says it all. he feels guilty because his conscience...
personnally, i agree with tg617... especially about coming to terms with sins and all of the flaws that we, as humans, have. Considering the album is called "The devil and God are raging inside of me" it probably means his mind in in turmoil of making the effort to be what he was raised as(a christian) and what he has become. Atemporal says it perfectly "he's a sinner whose eventually going to drown in the depths of the sea if he continues on his current path". the name of the album says it all. he feels guilty because his conscience is bringing him back to the person he was before he started giving in to his desire. And he is trying to decide if he should just keep doing things that he knows are wrong or if he should try to change.
Tuwy...no offense but even tho you're not a christian preacher as you say, with your post you're still trying to hammer this song into our heads as being religiously rooted(as if to reinforce Jesse's supposed belief in god) and i'm just not buying it. Here's Why: This song is simply about Jesse having lost his faith in God. Now that he thinks he knows (and being pretty much an atheist I would have to agree with him 100%) that there is no heaven and God he feels lost. I recall myself that I slept a lot easier when I was a child because hey...you're going to heaven when you die and everything is going to be alright. Well, studying philosophy, going to college, thinking for myself, doing my own research and recognizing that Christianity was actually invented by a king hundreds of years ago is enough for me to form my own conclusion about life after death...no one really "knows" what is going to happen. They may believe they do and feel very strongly and this may ease or totally rid them of their own "millstones" they may experience without their beliefs, but anyone who reads this should realize that their ease is only due to a "belief"...not a fact. Anyone who is heavily religious...really think about that and let it sink in for a moment. If you disagree with my standpoint please feel free to post back in reference to me...but at least put up a valid arguement and not a rash, angry rant as this will only make you look silly. The burden of knowing that he isn't going to heaven(or merely the fact that he just doesn't believe he will anymore now that he's renounced his religious beliefs) is FREAKING HIM OUT (he can't sleep anymore and so forth. This burden is the metaphorical "millstone" around his neck. When he says "Take me out Tonight" he is begging for someone or something to give him new faith to replace that which he has lost(again he has pretty much totally lost faith in God) in order ease his mind and conscience so he can "sleep without a single stir" as he did when he was a child...When everything was simpler because he just didn't really think or question things as much. When you're young, everything is pretty much cut and dry. You're going to heaven...everything is gonna be ok. Again beliefs can make you feel powerful emotions...but in the end they are just beliefs and not the ultimate truth. You only find that out after you die...if you are even capable of processing a logical thought at that point. (Ok, i'm getting too heady for myself so that's enough with the religious analysis). And again, when he asks for someone to be his "breath" he is looking for something( be it a person or a new way of life) to put the wind back in his sails. His loss of religious faith has really devestated him as I'm assuming he was very faithful to Christianity or whatever it was throughout his childhood and teen years. He could be asking for a person to share some new views with him...perhaps a new religion or just another way of life that helps people get by and be a little less insane knowing that one day they are going to die. Live just may not end the way the Catholic Church or other religions/institutions want you to believe. Stop letting religious dogmas rule your life and thoughts. As Timothy Leary said: "Think for yourself, question authority." I almost kinda miss the days when I used to go to church and believe in "their" God. It was really easy. I mean, for me to admit I don't believe in Christianity or any religion is really tough. Imagine believing so very strongly in something that BILLIONS of other people take part in worldwide, every day. Then imagine through your own conquest of thought and questioning that the reasoning you accepted wasn't yours at all, real, right or the truth. Imagine stepping outside of that box and feeling like you just got hit by a Mack Truck, you're on the same road and you know the way home but nothing feels right. On the walk home it just isn't the same and never will be again, ever because of this realization you have come to. You don't have to agree with me, but i believe this is what Jesse Lacey is trying to express with these lyrics. One thing i enjoyed was the metaphor terrorhawk suggested about the millstone being alcohol and the ship of fools being the bar scene. One thing my explanation didn't resolve was the ship of fools reference....but that metaphor works out quite nicely. Another way of looking at the song that makes sense. But thinking real quickly now I will tie that into my interpretation as well. When he says "The ship of fools I'm on will sink" I think he is merely referring to his current sinful and destructive path( he's not trying to impress his parents anymore, he's lost touch with his friends, doesn't pray anymore), and he doesn't really care. Yet in the back of his head there is still a part of him that would accept somebody removing him from this path, relieving the burden of his millstone and being his breath now that he is "drowning" for being a sinner in his new ways, but again : Now that he has lost his faith in God he doesn't go about things the way he used to and he can't (because he just doesn't believe anymore, it's just simply no longer in him). Also at the end of the song, two people are discussing if who they see is who they really think it is. They recognize the person but something is different that makes them question his identity :"I think I recognize him. Sure it's him?" This is Jesse explaining in a clever way how different he feels now that he has lost his faith. He feels so different that he doesn't think anyone will even recognize him anymore. I could really write about this all night but a few things that left me hanging in this song and they were 1."Never hit the brakes there's no time to save him, he's run out in the street" Perhaps this is referring to his loss of faith being as unexpected and tragic as being hit by a car...hmmm that ties really well into my "getting hit by a truck thing I mentioned before, so I am going to use this explanation.*sorry everyone I am writing this thing on the fly trying to do the best I can.
Hey man I know i am reading your post 2 and half years after you posted it and I pray that you have found the Truth but if not, all the more power to you. I am not replying to "rant" (as you would put it) but rather consider another view. First off all, i was wondering what "king" you think made up Christianity... and where you heard that. Secondly, I gathered from your post that you believe that Christianity is simply a "crutch" for the emotionally weak. So it is basically something we can lean...
Hey man I know i am reading your post 2 and half years after you posted it and I pray that you have found the Truth but if not, all the more power to you. I am not replying to "rant" (as you would put it) but rather consider another view. First off all, i was wondering what "king" you think made up Christianity... and where you heard that. Secondly, I gathered from your post that you believe that Christianity is simply a "crutch" for the emotionally weak. So it is basically something we can lean on when life gets too difficult? But I am here to ask... have you looked at it from your standpoint- assuming your still an atheist. Somewhere along the line, you came to the conclusion that you didn't believe in God. And just as we Believers lean on God, you have to lean on the fact that there is no God. My point here is just that if Christianity can be rejected as irrational simply because some people find it comforting, then the same must be true of atheism. And if atheism cannot be dismissed in this way, as the atheist will surely hold, then neither can Christianity. Atheism offers an easy way out for those unable to deal with the reality of life with God. Thirdly, if all that believers were after were a comforting belief system then they could do much better than Christianity. The Christian gospel, good news though it is, is not unequivocally comforting. The idea that if you believe in God then life’s a breeze over-simplifies the Christian experience. Christianity does not teach that Christians get an easy ride; in fact, it stresses that believers may well undergo great suffering in this life. It also makes people aware of their fallenness, of their sinfulness, and that can hurt. For all the comfort that Christianity offers in terms of eternal security, even its teachings about eternity have a downside; many Christians face the painful experience of expecting close friends and relatives to face just punishment for their sins. If believers were really just after comforting beliefs, then they could do a lot better than Christianity. For example, they could believe that suffering is just an illusion, that there are no moral constraints that oblige us not to do what we want to do, and that all (not just Christians) are destined to enjoy a blissful afterlife in heaven..... I do not expect this to instantly and dramatically change your life, but I hope you DO think about it, because if you just brush it off, you are contradicting your opinion of "belief" and leaning on your own personally emotional crutch. Please just give it a chance. If Jesus was just something I use to put my mind to rest about life after death, I would NOT be replying to your post in the first place. Know that someone out there is praying for you. God Bless
You don't need God to be content. God is a crutch. You can claim atheism is a crutch, but the LACK of something is not a crutch. It just means we DON'T think about the idea at all. We don't 'believe in atheism' because atheism is the denial of the existence of gods in general.
You don't need God to be content. God is a crutch. You can claim atheism is a crutch, but the LACK of something is not a crutch. It just means we DON'T think about the idea at all. We don't 'believe in atheism' because atheism is the denial of the existence of gods in general.
We just don't think about it at all. Its like asking some normal person if they're an 'anti-dog strangler'. You never categorized it into that kind of dichotomy before and so you just don't normally think about it.
We just don't think about it at all. Its like asking some normal person if they're an 'anti-dog strangler'. You never categorized it into that kind of dichotomy before and so you just don't normally think about it.
I'm honestly sorry for you that you...
I'm honestly sorry for you that you have taken the easy way out and feel as if you have discovered the answers. But, life is a journey and it is mighty ignorant of you to feel that you have it all worked out. Be a man like some of us who choose to face the journey and try and learn instead of being so smug as to thinking we have it all figured out.
Your god does not have the answer to everything and it would be ignorant to imply it. Your book even has a shitty description of him full of holes open to wide interpretation in that you and someone else who call themselves christians have no similar ideas whatsoever. Its a charade and a waste of time.
I advise you to please, PLEASE, get educated.
Even this is a bit off topic, I would like to say I was an atheist until I became more educated. This is because I used to think that I knew there was no God, now I know that this thought is irrational. Logically thinking, God is could be real, just as God could not be real. Just because something cannot be proven true does not mean it is false; just as something that cannot be proven false is true. In other words, just because one cannot prove God exists, does not mean he is not real, and vise versa....
Even this is a bit off topic, I would like to say I was an atheist until I became more educated. This is because I used to think that I knew there was no God, now I know that this thought is irrational. Logically thinking, God is could be real, just as God could not be real. Just because something cannot be proven true does not mean it is false; just as something that cannot be proven false is true. In other words, just because one cannot prove God exists, does not mean he is not real, and vise versa. Therefore, I became an agnostic. I hope this helps others come to the same conclusion as I.
personnally, i agree with tg617... especially about coming to terms with sins and all of the flaws that we, as humans, have. Considering the album is called "The devil and God are raging inside of me" it probably means his mind in in turmoil of making the effort to be what he was raised as(a christian) and what he has become. Atemporal says it perfectly "he's a sinner whose eventually going to drown in the depths of the sea if he continues on his current path". the name of the album says it all. he feels guilty because his conscience...
personnally, i agree with tg617... especially about coming to terms with sins and all of the flaws that we, as humans, have. Considering the album is called "The devil and God are raging inside of me" it probably means his mind in in turmoil of making the effort to be what he was raised as(a christian) and what he has become. Atemporal says it perfectly "he's a sinner whose eventually going to drown in the depths of the sea if he continues on his current path". the name of the album says it all. he feels guilty because his conscience is bringing him back to the person he was before he started giving in to his desire. And he is trying to decide if he should just keep doing things that he knows are wrong or if he should try to change.