One For The Vine

amazing song. why hasnt anyone spoken about it!? its highly profound and clever in its story telling. the jist of it is that one man is commanding many men to fight for a cause that nobody is really sure of. his self belief tho' is enough that the people will fight his cause. all but one who flees from it as his hope is lost. he falls into a parallel world only into a different role. suddenly people want to place thei misguided faith in him to battle for their freedom taking his arrival from nowhere as 'a sign'. well altho' dubious he feels that he should fight their cause and therefore leads them into battle only to see himself losing hope and fleeing from the battle behind him! the story is an eternal loop. its brilliant andgives u a lot to think about. theres a void of difference between havin the belief of people restin on ur shoulders and having to believe someone against your better judgement but it also shows just how easily these roles can be reversed and the outcomes of such a turnaround. brilliant.

What is very interesting about this song is the story is tranferable to any time period, as it operates as a metaphor. It is a story that applies in the present, where replacing governments can have behaviour more questionable than that of the replaced. The King is Dead, Long Live the King. It certainly has a circle of life aspect, and has the underpinning that power corrupts and absolute power corrupts absolutely.

The one who initially questions the leader ends up by a twist of fate to be a potential leader, himself. When alone "...he talked with water, and then with the vine" can have many meanings. It has religious connotations for me as much of Genesis' earlier work does. He steels himself so that he can make the decision to lead, initially by the drinking of water, then by the drinking of wine, which has always been referred to as the product of the vine. It is left to the reader / listener to decide whether he himself turns that water into wine or convinces himself that he does or just finds both. In any event he reaches a point where he has gained the courage or delusion to lead. It is arguable that he does not see himself completely as a god, as he realises that he may be leading his people "more likely to death" than "to glory". However, he certainly reaches a point where he is prepared to be the adored leader, without qualifications.

When he views another who "Stood up, and vanished into air" at the end of the song this again is a metaphor for the selling of one's soul for personal gain. It is the soul that vanishes, in the person he witnesses, just as it vanished in him.

Not to mention that musically, the song is very beautiful. The interplay between Steve Hackett on guitar & Tony Banks on keys is phenomenal, especially during the opening passage & the harmonies following the lyric "I must lead them to glory or most likely to death". Really great.

This is probably my favorite Genesis song, by a long shot...it's an absolutely beautiful song with wonderful melodies and a prime example of how Genesis was so great during the 70s. Most of the points I could make have already been made, but overall its lyrics present a classic "power corrupts" kind of story about a defector who gets lost on his voyage away from his twisted king, and finds a secluded tribe of primitive people in a cold, snowy wasteland. He fulfills their prophecy or whatever and he ends up leading them on a conquest. He later realizes he's no better than the king that he was running from in the first place.

The meaning can be taken as kind of simple or rudimentary i suppose, but the lyrics and delivery offer the story in such a beautifully haunting way...this song is a wonderful journey through the chaos of this man's values as he meets a culture by whom he is regarded as a savior—or a god, even. The lyrics do a nice job of providing a good amount of ambiguity to the ending.

One part I've never really understood fully (or at least been able to fit any logical meaning in with the rest) is the "There he talked with water/and then with the vine" line. I suppose it's a bit of introspective self-reflection on this man's part, considering "do I take advantage of these people's dreams or just dash their hopes and leave?"

Favorite Banks/Genesis song. The story is simple enough, but the "catch-22" element is what makes it brilliant. He's fed up as a follower, gets thrust into being a leader, starts to get fed up again until convinced by water and the vine (more on that below) then continues on, and what happened to him happens to one of his fed up followers (I don't think "he thought he recognized him by his walk and by the way he fell..." means himself, it's one of the followers that reminds him of what happened to himself).

So what about the title, and the water and the vine??? Well, in typical Banks fashion, it either means something incredibly special to the writer that we will never know for sure unless there's an interview quote somewhere, or it is just typcial 70s "prog rock imagery" that seemed cool to write. lol But I think Banks is brilliant, so it must have meaning. What I can come up with is water represents life, and the vine represents growth (or even escape). So when he "talks" with water and the vine, they convince him to carry on, I assume the idea is that he will allow his followers to live and grow (or escape their oppressors) by not giving up (again).

Favorite post-Gabriel Genesis song. Tony Banks is just criminally underrated as both a keyboardist and songwriter/lyricist. Eminently beautiful music-crafting mingles with storytelling to make Tolkien proud, yielding a song I routinely seek out in my searches for great live Genesis recordings. I think it's less religious in theme or overtones than perhaps a cautionary tale about following warmongering leaders. Change your own water into wine. Listening right now to the version they did in Dijon, France, 6/3/78. (Daryl Steurmer does a good, though not excellent job of mimicking Steve Hackett on the delicate melodic nuances, but it comes off nicely. I prefer Steve on this song.)

what a fantastic song. why isn't there more comments? genesis is very underated; they have such a unique, abstract syle.

I know I'm wrong or whatever but when I hear this song it seems like Banks is talking about Christ gaining ppl into christianity, good and bad. The middle part before the 2nd half is beautifully arranged by banks.

haroldbarrel i actually could agree with your hypothesis. you listen well.

From what I can gather, a disillusioned soldier strays from his group and falls off the mountain he's ascending. He meets a group of people who take them to be his savior. He feels he must lead them to where they want to go. Finally, he has importance, he's not just one of the troops. He marches along until he sees the mountain he fell off of. He sees himself fall and (uh oh, mindf*ck) vanish. This song is great for the seemingly believable story, until the very last line, when the plot goes through a huge twist, which makes us question what really happened.