Fragments

I agree with fireinthedawn.

I'm just going to post this one last time here, that it is not an endorsement of fascism. As I said in the other two places I posted this, I wrote to the VNV Nation info address and asked for a statement on some of their fans being white supremicists and this is the answer I got:

"Hi there,

Thanks for writing.

To be honest, this is the first time I've heard of any fans being vocal about white supremacist views. I've seen arguments between people with very deeply held religious beliefs about the interpretation of songs but nothing akin to what you're telling us about.

I am sorry that your experience has given you cause to wonder about us. Even a cursory view of our lyrics would tell people that our message is a positive and benevolent one. It is a message of self betterment. It is humanist and it goes out to people all over the world. We have been on record saying this many times. Our fanbase includes people from a large number of ethnic backgrounds and nationalities, people from a large number of different religions, those with deeply held spiritual beliefs and those without, people with different political beliefs, lifestyles and sexual orientation. We are very proud of this. We are especially proud to know that our music and words provide a common meaning to such a wide variety of people.

Our music and its message are most definitely non exclusive and do not stem from or espouse an ideology or political message. What we don't want is to be promoted by anyone with an extremist view should it lead others to think that we share those views, whatever they may be. As for our line on fans with extreme views : In my travels, I have met many people through VNV Nation with views that would be called "extremist", both religious or political. Reading that, one might assume that I mean people with extreme right wing opinions or of European origin but It would surprise many to know that this is not the case not to mention the range of views that I have come across and from people of very different ethnic backgrounds and orientation. My line has always been that, people will hold whatever view they wish to hold, no matter what anyone has to say. BUT.. these views are their own and should not be promoted in conjunction with VNV Nation. We are quite categorical in that we do not share any extremist views of a racial, political or religious nature. One thing we definitely do not agree with is any message that promotes hatred. I welcome the chance for people to discuss their views in an orderly and intellectual manner in the appropriate setting. The world is full of differing views, but that does not mean people cannot discuss what they believe in an effort to learn more about one another and hopefully to come to a better point of view about the world.

Though it is a rare occurrence, it is not the first time Mark or I have been asked about our personal views on white supremacy. My answer has always been to suggest that those asking speak to our friends, in particular those who are gay or lesbian, Jewish, Muslim, Buddhist or of African descent. That might take a while as there are quite a few. Something similar to your question happened when we played at an Aids benefit and received emails asking if we were gay and advocate gay rights. This question came from people on both sides of the subject. We're advocates of nothing other than a world with a common goal of solving our mounting problems together, not throwing stones at one another and emphasising our differences.

I hope this answers your question.

regards, Ronan"

I think VNVN quotes Henry V more than any band ever.

Fortunately, any meaning in this song has passed right over my head. All I get are these insane images of the heroic past...and maybe that's all this song does. I think of Valhalla, the movie Gladiator, and by association, Elysium ("What we do in life echoes through eternity"), and Beowulf (not the movie, amazing at it was), all in one insane techno-throbbing glory-filled paradise.

this song sums up all the underlying psychology and patriotic influences that have driven great armies to conquer their enemies over the past few thousand years of human history.

the cheers of the crowds, the great honor of dying in battle (the hall of ages to welcome them), the nameless enemy (faces etched in stone), acts of bravery (once more to the breach..), etc.

This is to expose the strategy emperors have used to call men to arms. promises of great things to come. it's an exposure to propaganda.

This song, as well as the entire album, illustrate the seeming glory but ultimate folly and failure of the concept of empire. Especially Hitler's.

Waldemar, you are an idiot.

Anyways, I agree with Icexe.

Anyways, I agree with Icexe.

Certainly seems like a commentary on what soldiers might be thinking about war, as icexe.

And I must say, Waldemar, before you try to do anything involving empires forged out of war, or asserting racial superiority, you might want to grow half a brain. For instance, just because someone (like Sunder) disagrees with your view, that doesn't mean he's automatically of another race that you find inferior, and it doesn't mean he likes rap. Obviously you're quite close-minded and/or unintelligent.

And why put "independed-minded" (sic, nice spelling Xp) in quotes? Anyone who has a pulse and values their freedom will certainly cry out against Fascism. Because Fascism steals all the freedom out of its citizens -- or perhaps denizens.

In an case, before you shout your cause from rooftops, learn 1) To spell; people might to you a little more seriously, 2) Respect opposing points of view, or if you prefer me to say "respect your enemies"

P.S. Oh, and I know you might not know English that well, because it sounds like you're Russian, but hey, I can ridicule your English if you're saying all black people have AIDS and listen to rap, right? In fact, maybe I'll just say all Russians are Fascist racists. Fair fighting to you, it seems.

waldmar is the exact opposite of what VNV Nation stands for.

Icexe, Sunder, & CherryTrauma are on the mark.